Leading secondary schools for oxbridge offers

Moderators: Section Moderators, Forum Moderators

sonu17
Posts: 54
Joined: Tue Sep 16, 2014 4:03 pm

Re: Leading secondary schools for oxbridge offers

Post by sonu17 »

Most unis consider the relative performance of a student Vs his peers in the same school. So all things considered equal, I agree an above-average student would have a better chance of a uni offer if he/she applies from an underperforming school in the state sector.

However, we should also be aware that:
1. in practice talent is not uniformally distributed across the state/grammar/private sectors and unis are aware of the fact that grammars (and indies) have disproportionately (more of) better performing students, so they would offer more places to such schools
2. no parent voluntarily takes out their well-performing child from grammar/indie and moves him/her into an underperforming state comprehensive just for the sake of achieving a uni offer
nyr
Posts: 1167
Joined: Thu Apr 04, 2013 11:39 am

Re: Leading secondary schools for oxbridge offers

Post by nyr »

sonu17 wrote: Mon Feb 19, 2024 9:26 pm 2. no parent voluntarily takes out their well-performing child from grammar/indie and moves him/her into an underperforming state comprehensive just for the sake of achieving a uni offer
I know parents who have pulled students out of highly selective independents for state sixth-form, mentioned on this thread, in the hope of improving their DC's oxbridge chances.
ToadMum
Posts: 11971
Joined: Wed Jan 18, 2012 12:41 pm
Location: Essex

Re: Leading secondary schools for oxbridge offers

Post by ToadMum »

nyr wrote: Wed Feb 21, 2024 12:01 am
sonu17 wrote: Mon Feb 19, 2024 9:26 pm 2. no parent voluntarily takes out their well-performing child from grammar/indie and moves him/her into an underperforming state comprehensive just for the sake of achieving a uni offer
I know parents who have pulled students out of highly selective independents for state sixth-form, mentioned on this thread, in the hope of improving their DC's oxbridge chances.
And then got a bit of a shock when their DC told them that the UCAS application requires them to enter details of where they took their (?I)GCSEs as well, no doubt...
Outside of a dog, a book is a man's best friend. Inside of a dog it's too dark to read.Groucho Marx
Ann.kumar
Posts: 117
Joined: Mon Sep 05, 2022 9:28 pm

Re: Leading secondary schools for oxbridge offers

Post by Ann.kumar »

ToadMum wrote: Wed Feb 21, 2024 7:49 am
nyr wrote: Wed Feb 21, 2024 12:01 am
sonu17 wrote: Mon Feb 19, 2024 9:26 pm 2. no parent voluntarily takes out their well-performing child from grammar/indie and moves him/her into an underperforming state comprehensive just for the sake of achieving a uni offer
I know parents who have pulled students out of highly selective independents for state sixth-form, mentioned on this thread, in the hope of improving their DC's oxbridge chances.
And then got a bit of a shock when their DC told them that the UCAS application requires them to enter details of where they took their (?I)GCSEs as well, no doubt...
The state sixth-form mentioned in this thread are by no means underperforming comprehensive. Any parents with a little understanding how this work would understand.
nyr
Posts: 1167
Joined: Thu Apr 04, 2013 11:39 am

Re: Leading secondary schools for oxbridge offers

Post by nyr »

ToadMum wrote: Wed Feb 21, 2024 7:49 am
nyr wrote: Wed Feb 21, 2024 12:01 am I know parents who have pulled students out of highly selective independents for state sixth-form, mentioned on this thread, in the hope of improving their DC's oxbridge chances.
And then got a bit of a shock when their DC told them that the UCAS application requires them to enter details of where they took their (?I)GCSEs as well, no doubt...
The parents I know had varying degrees of success with their gamble. No one know what their children might have achieved if they'd stayed put.

The reality is that those with children at leading independent schools have felt for quite some time that the ground with regards to Oxbridge is shifting away from them and this seems to be backed up by data published by Cambridge. The problem is that it's aggregated data. It's difficult for parents to decipher exactly what "leveling-up" criteria will be used when their DC applies. I remember that when DS was at the end of Y12 a Cambridge admissions tutor, who gave a talk at his state grammar (which doesn't have a sixth-form entry point), made it quite clear that any uplift would be for socio-economically disadvantaged applicants, rather than state school applicants in general. This was a surprise to the parents who raised queries around the topic. August reconsideration is very clearly for disadvanatged pupils but in general it's really not clear what criteria are being applied when. The steady growth in the Oxbridge number at QE, where the vast majority of students are unlikely to be disadvantaged, could be due to a better understanding of the application process and the support that staff and the peer group offer but it would be interesting to uncover how other sixth-forms, such as Woodhouse, have achieved the high number of offers.
Ann.kumar
Posts: 117
Joined: Mon Sep 05, 2022 9:28 pm

Re: Leading secondary schools for oxbridge offers

Post by Ann.kumar »


The steady growth in the Oxbridge number at QE, where the vast majority of students are unlikely to be disadvantaged, could be due to a better understanding of the application process and the support that staff and the peer group offer but it would be interesting to uncover how other sixth-forms, such as Woodhouse, have achieved the high number of offers.
Or it could just simply due to the steady increase of the 11+ standardised admission score QE had in recent years.

Or just uncover Woodhouse / Harris Westminster have better teaching staff that support that understanding the application process.

It still won't uncover how private school like Westminster had a record Oxbridge number this year.
Webbol
Posts: 59
Joined: Sat Oct 26, 2013 3:55 pm

Re: Leading secondary schools for oxbridge offers

Post by Webbol »

nyr wrote: Wed Feb 21, 2024 1:59 pm
ToadMum wrote: Wed Feb 21, 2024 7:49 am
nyr wrote: Wed Feb 21, 2024 12:01 am I know parents who have pulled students out of highly selective independents for state sixth-form, mentioned on this thread, in the hope of improving their DC's oxbridge chances.
And then got a bit of a shock when their DC told them that the UCAS application requires them to enter details of where they took their (?I)GCSEs as well, no doubt...
The parents I know had varying degrees of success with their gamble. No one know what their children might have achieved if they'd stayed put.

The reality is that those with children at leading independent schools have felt for quite some time that the ground with regards to Oxbridge is shifting away from them and this seems to be backed up by data published by Cambridge. The problem is that it's aggregated data. It's difficult for parents to decipher exactly what "leveling-up" criteria will be used when their DC applies. I remember that when DS was at the end of Y12 a Cambridge admissions tutor, who gave a talk at his state grammar (which doesn't have a sixth-form entry point), made it quite clear that any uplift would be for socio-economically disadvantaged applicants, rather than state school applicants in general. This was a surprise to the parents who raised queries around the topic. August reconsideration is very clearly for disadvanatged pupils but in general it's really not clear what criteria are being applied when. The steady growth in the Oxbridge number at QE, where the vast majority of students are unlikely to be disadvantaged, could be due to a better understanding of the application process and the support that staff and the peer group offer but it would be interesting to uncover how other sixth-forms, such as Woodhouse, have achieved the high number of offers.
Do they though? Get a high number of offers? There are 750 students a year in Woodhouse. In the past 3 years they have got 26, 27, 43 offers. Their entrance requirements are higher than a school like DAOS. That’s a fairly low rate achieving Oxbridge offers.
Ann.kumar
Posts: 117
Joined: Mon Sep 05, 2022 9:28 pm

Re: Leading secondary schools for oxbridge offers

Post by Ann.kumar »

Webbol wrote: Fri Feb 23, 2024 8:50 am Do they though? Get a high number of offers? There are 750 students a year in Woodhouse. In the past 3 years they have got 26, 27, 43 offers. Their entrance requirements are higher than a school like DAOS. That’s a fairly low rate achieving Oxbridge offers.
A few years ago, Woodhouse only got less than 20 students into Oxbridge per year, but the upward trend is clear.

DAO and Woodhouse have similar sixth form entry requirements, both of which are lower than some of the other schools discussed in this thread. This suggests that the schools have a broader range of student abilities, e.g. average 7-8 GCSE points per A-level subject, compared to nearly 9+ GCSE points for some of the other sixth form groups. However, the question is, do the high-achieving students in DAO or Woodhouse have a better or equal chance of getting into Oxbridge than those in the more selective schools? Does a school with 30/40 Oxbridge students provide enough Oxbridge support relative to a school with 50/60 students with higher number of top performing achievers due to stricter initial selection? DAO usually has 80 students apply for Oxbridge every year, while Woodhouse has about 150 students. The success rate is similar based on the most recent data at about 30%.
Aethel
Posts: 1214
Joined: Sun Dec 20, 2015 6:24 pm

Re: Leading secondary schools for oxbridge offers

Post by Aethel »

Um… one would hope that Oxford/Cambridge can select the students they think are best suited for their places ?
Post Reply
11 Plus Mocks - Practise the real exam experience - Book Now