New Test

[Rugbymum]

I would have thought the new test would see a drop in professional tutoring...TBH I would not have used a tutor if I had known what it would have been like and have no plans to use one again if my 2nd child wants to enter this.

[Sassie'sDad]

Hi Charlotte67,
I understand your reservations but disagree that 'ordinary parents' are less able to help in 'preparation' for the new test. Also the new test includes Non VR and it is that element that is claimed to be 'tutor proof'.

At Christmas I was the 'fly on the wall' during a conversation between a maths teacher and Head Teacher of an Independent Preparatory preparing for Independent Secondary and Eleven Plus. They were quite clearly still using a targeted approach largely along the lines of NFER (supposedly appropriate to Indi's but not to the CEM bespoke paper!). In a couple of weeks I shall find out their results. They should make interesting comparison with State Primary children!*

I made a significant input to my dd's preparation for eleven plus. I should also declare that she additionally had 1 hour a week preparation (during term time) over the last year from a professional tutor.
This was because she had spent the previous 18 months in a sink Primary in Coventry.

I was one of the few who picked up on the change to mixed format from Standard format and the significant consequent need for the candidate to work quickly and not to expect to be able to backtrack (paper divided into discreet sections/booklets). After the exam several tutors agreed they were terrified to discover the advice they had given (based on past practice - to go back over questions and tackle answering the difficult questions on the second pass) was completely useless and had mislead their candidates into a false sense of confidence about their 'methodology'. - Sounds like RugbyMum came across this too.

If one scours the public information on their own website, it is quite possible to get a handle on what CEM are measuring and how. (I see no real difference between their bespoke paper and their computerised tests.) It is even possible to get an indication of their computerised testing, which is unique in its adaptive approach.

*My dd and three others from her Primary sat the Computerised test last January. Two of them passed and were given Foundation Scholarships. 'Been living on cloud 8.5 ever since!

[Sassie'sDad]

I think you will find that although VR is important and a good indicator it is Non VR which is the best indicator taken in conjunction with the other disciplines. The new test (CEM) is the first to include this in 11+ for Warwickshire.
I also reject the assertion that this is tutor proof. I take your point that the inequality of opportunity (tutoring) is a profoundly unfair in relation to the 11+ but then nothing about Grammar Schools and 11+ is fair any more!

[Charlotte67]

I think you will find that although VR is important and a good indicator it is Non VR which is the best indicator taken in conjunction with the other disciplines.

Then why is VR so widely used (and frequently exclusively)?

I also reject the assertion that this is tutor proof.

I agree. This 'tutor proof' assertion is nonsense! Tutored children will always have an advantage.

[Sassie'sDad]

My view is that different kinds of schools, traditions of teaching, look for different qualities of learning/achievement. They take a view of the added value they can bring to the future learning of the individual, whom they anticipate joining their school, and expect to thrive. (In the case of scholars, they are expected to do really well. Indeed it is a condition of their tenure they do so. Reasonable enough seems to me!) Broadly speaking Indy s go for NFER and VR. Maintained are heading towards more psychometric / personality based techniques.

[Charlotte67]

My view is that different kinds of schools, traditions of teaching, look for different qualities of learning/achievement. They take a view of the added value they can bring to the future learning of the individual, whom they anticipate joining their school, and expect to thrive.

That's all well and good if there is any choice but most people find that they have no choice but to send their children to the local state school. In fact, reading some posts on this forum, it seems that even this is sometimes in question.

[Ed's mum]

I would have thought the new test would see a drop in professional tutoring...TBH I would not have used a tutor if I had known what it would have been like and have no plans to use one again if my 2nd child wants to enter this.

Hi Rugbymum, I have just been re-reading some threads on the Warks section as I have done NO prep for my daughter and I honestly do not know why I have been so lax about it!!!

Thankfull, she is a motivated child and always seems to be learning about something.

I came upon the above quote and wondered exactly how far you would take this stance? Do you mean no private tutor but lots of work at home? Or do you mean little or no preparation at all??

Pls put my mind at rest as I am so furious with myself for not doing anything with Miss Ed...

[Rugbymum]

By this I meant preparation at home, its just that I think its helpful if children got their head around the whole idea of doing timed papers and being able to work quickly and accurately, aware that they cannot turn back pages to check etc. Its more of a confidence thing to ensure that they don't get stage fright which is what has happened to a couple of very able and bright friends.

[Ed's mum]

Thanks for that.

Luckily, she has sat this morning and done some VR and NVR and had a big grin on her face as she was doing it!