Min. Level 5 required for Grammar School??

[wonderwoman]

Hi All
At the parents evening at Wilson's Grammar last summer, the Head Master did mention that children should be working towards to a good Level 5 in order to be able to cope with grammar school.
HSP2201

I think this may be a deliberate attempt to discourage some applicants.

[parent2013]

Wilson is a super-selective like Olave's & Judd. They test on English Creative Writing alongside descriptive Maths. It could be that the head-teacher is expecting children to join Y7 in Sep (not at the time of giving 11 plus exam) with level 5A. It is quite similar to Olave's HT who said that you should be in the top 2 of your class to stand a decent chance (very much like don't waste our time by giving exam if you are not in top 2).

[southbucks3]

Hi OP..Can't remember your handle.

I have just looked at results league tables, even though I do not believe in them for choosing schools, for results of your boys school. I have discovered it is comfortably sandwiched between two bucks area grammar schools, including my sons. You really do not have to worry about him coping, with a 4a he will do just fine I promise. There are plenty of boys who are happily moving through level 6 in year 7 and 8. Sometimes my boy produces a level 6 bit of work, then a level 7, a lot depends on his mind set, boys are notoriously unstable at English. (Except son number two, who is a English writing boffin, but hates the sciences...They thought he was a girl in the womb ).
Just be proud of your little man's achievements and don't worry about anyone else's kids, like most of us you won't relax until you get his first report, I wanted ds1 to be firmly in the middle, he was and a bit more (except French to which he replied I can barely cope with speaking English to teachers, what do you expect). Saying that, if the lazy little wotsit doesn't get decent end of year 8 test results I will send him off to military academy to show him the alternative to revising!

Personally think that the schools who only want "top two" kids are admitting they cannot add value as efficiently as other schools.

[Peridot]

A quick aside here - parent2013 and others - I see this phrased wrongly on so many posts that I thought I would just make a comment to clarify... In English we don't "give" an exam; we "take" an exam. So instead of saying, "at the time of giving the 11 plus exam", we should say, correctly, "at the time of taking the 11 plus exam". This language of ours is complicated but we should strive to get it right to avoid confusion!

Just crossed posts with southbucks3 and I totally agree with her! Parent2013 that's enough doom-mongering! OP your son will be fine...

[parent2013]

Comments by Parent2013........Level 5A or Level 6......I agree some may achieve these levels at the end of year 6 but after hearing from parents, relieved to say that I think my son is doing just OK and hopefully he will continue to do so.

Once again to all the parents who responded with very kind warm words of advice. Really appreciated and certainly feel at ease now.

Getting into GS is definitely an achievement in itself. Obviously in the class, there will be children in the top group and bottom group. I guess L6 would be the former and L4/5 would be in the latter. As long as the parent & child can accept the fact that after being in the top group in primary for years, one could land up in bottom group at GS, it should be fine.

Sb - If you've diligently looked at the league tables, you would surely remember the top 5 GS in the country. They prefer only top 2 to give ..... ooops I mean take the exam. Do "Creme de la creme" children require value addition??

Pdot - You sound like a primary school teacher.

[kenyancowgirl]

Oh for goodness sake parent2013, stop being so pompous!

Your child passed the 11+, that is great. But for all the children who do pass there are others that are FAR brighter that didn't - it is a one day test. The children that get through are not the creme-de-la creme. The others are just as worthy and to suggest otherwise is disingenuous. And, YES, ALL schools are required by Ofsted to show value added, otherwise they are not doing their jobs, regardless of how many A* grades the kids come out with!

[kittymum]

Oh for goodness sake parent2013, stop being so pompous!

Your child passed the 11+, that is great. But for all the children who do pass there are others that are FAR brighter that didn't - it is a one day test. The children that get through are not the creme-de-la creme. The others are just as worthy and to suggest otherwise is disingenuous. And, YES, ALL schools are required by Ofsted to show value added, otherwise they are not doing their jobs, regardless of how many A* grades the kids come out with!

Totally agree.

Also all this top 2 business - top 2 of what? Cohorts vary - some are more academic then others. Of course all schools should add value to all children - what a strange idea that it might be ok not to do that with the "creme de la creme" (hideous expression to use re children imvho).

[southbucks3]

As long as the parent & child can accept the fact that after being in the top group in primary for years, one could land up in bottom group at GS, it should be fine.

I have no idea about the ops son's school Wallington, but grammars round here often do not stream until year 8 or in case of rgs year 9. Upper Schools, that do stream, tend to do so after the first term and often after children have sat cat tests.

Sb - If you've diligently looked at the league tables, you would surely remember the top 5 GS in the country. They prefer only top 2 to give ..... ooops I mean take the exam. Do "Creme de la creme" children require value addition??

I have not diligently studied, I merely looked up the position of Wallington, so that i felt equipped to see what level they were at and whether the op's son would be in a super duper selective. He will not, his one level 4a will serve him just fine as a starting point.

Schools that accept only the top 2, creme de la creme, top 5% of county, etc etc, yawn yawn, who's pupils are all supposedly entering on level 5a or 6 have less levels to break through on the way to an a* at gcse, do these schools add extra studies beyond the normal gcse curriculum?

Sats are just one component, the 11+ is just one component, cat scores are just one component, the ability to behave well and work hard is a huge component. Alll these elements together paint a better picture of the child's true ability than a 5a. To be blunt son number 2 with his three predicted 5a scores would have a big open doorway into grammar if sats were that relevant on their own!

[Daogroupie]

Year after year the students who get into DAO and QE and HBS from our local area are not the ones that are the top two in the class as judged by their primary teachers but the ones that apply themselves to the matter in hand. Then, even though they sit the entrance exams in the September of Year Six, some of their teachers appear not to notice their new levels and refuse to enter them for Level Six exams eight months later in May. A student I know of had a top Fifteen place at DAO and a mark in the 260's for QE and in the 260's for Parmiters and a place at Mill Hill, but the primary school still refused to enter him for L6 English until his parents kicked up a fuss. Then when the results came out he was the only student in the year to achieve L6 English. He is now in the top English set at QE. Not one of the students that the primary school had designated gifted and talented in English managed to secure a Level 6. So St Olaves really should not trust the primary schools to be deciding who are the students most likely to be able to win places at their school because in my experience the primary school are quite often wrong. It is hard to really keep track of an individual student's progress in a class of 30. The TA is much more likely to have a handle on it as they spend the time working with individual students. DG

[kittymum]

Sorry I'm in a contrary mood but I would like to say that the ability to get a Level 6 in English is very different from being gifted and talented in English! (Comment specifically related to the level 6 papers as opposed to a TA level 6)